Christian: OK, fair enough. The city is coming to prominence in a way it never could before - we hope. After years of Giuliani and his successor's efforts to clean it up, the idea of New York City's old urban decay has a certain twisted romance.
But let's talk about this: if the world is more realistic and involving, then can gamers enjoy themselves in the same way as in the cartoonish cities of the past? If the make-your-own-fun of GTA is the draw, then where do we go from here, in Niko Bellic's Liberty City?
And if the game is all that different, will it throw fans of the GTA III trilogy for a loop?
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Brett: I'll leave Mikel to decide the larger implications of such a topic (he's the fanboy after all), but from my perspective, the loss of "out there" gameplay ideas grounds the series in a way that I find unappealing. I'm not all that into super violent games, but I love messing with crap. Crackdown kept the blood and violence silly yet allowed for gameplay freedoms the genre had never seen before. If GTA IV is as real-world as the tech currently allows, I'm not sure how fun it'll be to crash a car into a sidewalk full of people. The loss of a jetpack or unicycle or whatever is noticeable, but if the overall design needs a more serious tone, then so be it. I'm sure people will find plenty of off-the-wall things to do.
Mikel: Yeah, I'm kind of torn on the question of realism and violence. I'm excited to see what Rockstar's going to do with it, but making violence "realistic" can be touchy. 25 to Life tried to do it, in its crass little way, and the whimpers and gurgled pleas that followed gunshots in that game made killing people like pulling teeth. Which is probably how it should be, but I play games for entertainment, not so I can learn to withstand the stress of an actual murder (regardless of what a certain white-haired lawyer thinks).
If it's handled well, though, it could be something that makes players a little more thoughtful about lethal violence, and a little more reluctant to use it - much like a real petty criminal would be. It might even give the game some tension that it didn't have before; if drawing a gun, much less firing it, carries serious consequences, when is the right time to do it? How threatened do you need to feel?
At the same time, though, Brett's right; part of the thrill of GTA is doing stuff like plowing your car into crowds, and if the game handles something like that too realistically, it'll be a completely different kind of game. I'm sure it'll still be fun in different ways, but it won't be the same kind of cathartic mayhem that GTA fans have come to love, and a lot of those fans might end up losing their taste for it. If the series really wants to grow up, though, maybe that's something that'll have to happen.
Then again, maybe not; given all the explosions and chopper-hanging and crazy driving in the trailer, it kind of laid to rest a lot of my fears about the game becoming too realistic. And to be fair, we're basing our ideas about the grimmer, more realistic tone based mostly on the look of Liberty City and the vague things Rockstar's been telling us. Remember, this trailer is the first time we've even seen Niko talk (voice-overs don't count). Who's to say, at this point, that there won't be a sense of humor behind all the drama? Even The Sopranos had an overarching sense of fun, and it was still a serious, realistic show.The comedymight be darker or more subtle or more bitter than we're used to, but I really can't imagine Rockstar making a game that doesn't have its tongue planted, to some degree, in its cheek.
July 3, 2007
Christian: OK, fair enough. The city is coming to prominence in a way it never could before - we hope. After years of Giuliani and his successor's efforts to clean it up, the idea of New York City's old urban decay has a certain twisted romance.
But let's talk about this: if the world is more realistic and involving, then can gamers enjoy themselves in the same way as in the cartoonish cities of the past? If the make-your-own-fun of GTA is the draw, then where do we go from here, in Niko Bellic's Liberty City?
And if the game is all that different, will it throw fans of the GTA III trilogy for a loop?
Brett: I'll leave Mikel to decide the larger implications of such a topic (he's the fanboy after all), but from my perspective, the loss of "out there" gameplay ideas grounds the series in a way that I find unappealing. I'm not all that into super violent games, but I love messing with crap. Crackdown kept the blood and violence silly yet allowed for gameplay freedoms the genre had never seen before. If GTA IV is as real-world as the tech currently allows, I'm not sure how fun it'll be to crash a car into a sidewalk full of people. The loss of a jetpack or unicycle or whatever is noticeable, but if the overall design needs a more serious tone, then so be it. I'm sure people will find plenty of off-the-wall things to do.
Mikel: Yeah, I'm kind of torn on the question of realism and violence. I'm excited to see what Rockstar's going to do with it, but making violence "realistic" can be touchy. 25 to Life tried to do it, in its crass little way, and the whimpers and gurgled pleas that followed gunshots in that game made killing people like pulling teeth. Which is probably how it should be, but I play games for entertainment, not so I can learn to withstand the stress of an actual murder (regardless of what a certain white-haired lawyer thinks).
If it's handled well, though, it could be something that makes players a little more thoughtful about lethal violence, and a little more reluctant to use it - much like a real petty criminal would be. It might even give the game some tension that it didn't have before; if drawing a gun, much less firing it, carries serious consequences, when is the right time to do it? How threatened do you need to feel?
At the same time, though, Brett's right; part of the thrill of GTA is doing stuff like plowing your car into crowds, and if the game handles something like that too realistically, it'll be a completely different kind of game. I'm sure it'll still be fun in different ways, but it won't be the same kind of cathartic mayhem that GTA fans have come to love, and a lot of those fans might end up losing their taste for it. If the series really wants to grow up, though, maybe that's something that'll have to happen.
Then again, maybe not; given all the explosions and chopper-hanging and crazy driving in the trailer, it kind of laid to rest a lot of my fears about the game becoming too realistic. And to be fair, we're basing our ideas about the grimmer, more realistic tone based mostly on the look of Liberty City and the vague things Rockstar's been telling us. Remember, this trailer is the first time we've even seen Niko talk (voice-overs don't count). Who's to say, at this point, that there won't be a sense of humor behind all the drama? Even The Sopranos had an overarching sense of fun, and it was still a serious, realistic show.The comedymight be darker or more subtle or more bitter than we're used to, but I really can't imagine Rockstar making a game that doesn't have its tongue planted, to some degree, in its cheek.
July 3, 2007
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