• chris-thrasher - October 30, 2014 12:11 p.m.

    Definitely have to switch mains. Shiek is absolute garbage. NO launch power until much higher percentages. Been getting manhandled. Wish they kept her at Melee strength.
  • Elgyem - October 11, 2014 8:23 a.m.

    I may be alone on saying this, but I view jigglypuff as being a very dominant character in this game. It retains a lot of what made it so phenomenal in Melee and PM and most characters struggle to defend against it's fast aerial game (it feels nearly identical to Melee and PM). It may lack the instakill rest like in previous iterations, but overall jiggles retains much of what made it so deadly and so fun in the past.
  • TittyKitty - October 9, 2014 1:01 p.m.

    Competitive fighting game players are all a bunch of douchebags. I mean, it's bad enough that they devote pretty much their entire existence to being better than everyone else at a video game, but on top of that they don't even do it honestly. It's ridiculous that it's considered acceptable to exploit glitches, analyze frame data, and all that other nonsense. Smash Bros. and every other fighting game would be a whole lot more fun if everyone just played casually instead of spending every waking moment analyzing the game to find any possible way to have an advantage over their opponent. Playing against the CPU gets old fast, but it's pretty much impossible to even stand a chance online without studying the game like a book, which is just dumb. Who has the time for that? Not to mention it completely destroys the magic of the game and just turns it into a pissing contest to see who the biggest loser with the most time on their hands is.
  • Kyubeytor - October 10, 2014 8:54 p.m.

    I'm a douchebag just for enjoying a game series a different way then you? Okay. "It's ridiculous that it's considered acceptable to exploit glitches, analyze frame data, and all that other nonsense." FYI, Smash bros metagame is not about exploiting glitches, other than a few acceptations like DACUS and Samus's super wavedash. Wavedashing is just a simple corner case of the game's physics engine. You air dodge into the ground, your momentum transfers. Makes sense to me. How is analyzing frame data unacceptable? That makes literally no sense, everyone has access to it. "Smash Bros. and every other fighting game would be a whole lot more fun if everyone just played casually instead of spending every waking moment analyzing the game to find any possible way to have an advantage over their opponent" How are tournaments somehow intercepting casual player's fun? Newsflash, not everybody finds the same things fun, but you act like casual only Smash is objectively more fun and would be for everyone else. I enjoy analyzing a game simply because I am a competitive person and enjoy mastering something. For example, I have put tons of time into the Attack on Titan tribute game despite there being no true, fair versus mode. I do this simply because I enjoy mastery. "Playing against the CPU gets old fast, but it's pretty much impossible to even stand a chance online without studying the game like a book, which is just dumb" Again, you present your opinion as if it was a fact. How am I supposed to study the game like a book despite only owning it for a few days? I only got in 2 days ago, but my link wins most matches. Just simply watching an advanced tutorial on your character is extremely enlightening. Are chess players also dumb for analyzing their game? "Not to mention it completely destroys the magic of the game " I repeat: you think you opinion is fact. I started competitive play a few months ago, and Smash has never been so fun or magical before. I recommend you watch the Melee documentary. I'm interested to hear if you think the perfectly good people in this project are "douchbags" after that.
  • z0mfg - October 13, 2014 9:20 a.m.

    Why call a dougebad someone who likes a game and cares to be better by investigating what's the best to do on which situation? It's like science, you investigate the world all the way to its cells, molecules etc..equals to frame data and exact information about the hitboxes in games.
  • lex-ryan - October 30, 2014 9:02 a.m.

    Honestly it's totally understandable. There are two ways to enjoy a game, A) For the fiction, and B) For the mechanics. For the former, stuff like frame data takes a steaming crap on the fiction; if Mario were to really fight Bowser, stuff like invincibility frames don't exist, it's just all mechanics to give balance and the illusion of reality. The only things that are truly real are, well, real. So it's understandably frustrating when another person ruins your imagination/escape from reality by heavily focusing on reality, effectively killing the mood. For the later, how can you stand a chance in a competitive game? Or be a master of a game, without analyzing the mechanics on a critical level? It's fun, it's entertaining, seeing what makes a game tick is incredibly interesting. But now, the former is easily frustrating to the point of vocalization, which in turn makes the later frustrating to the point of vocalization, which in turn throws even more fuel on the fire of the former... unfortunately endless cycles are usually proof of no right answer, and also never reach a satisfying end. Best thing to do is try to mediate like this and save a few people the frustration :/
  • SurooshX - October 9, 2014 3:41 a.m.

    I'm very happy this article exists. Thank you, Ken. I'm really enjoying the game so far. There are just two things that kinda bug me. Rolling is waaaaay too good in this game. I feel like when you get two players that know what they're doing it becomes Rolling Simulator for 3DS. I think this issue could be somewhat alleviated and that leads to my second issue. I really wish there were Battlefield or platform-based variants on stages and not just FD forms. I don't know who on the dev team thought pro/serious/glorious players only play on FD, but it's all wrong. Really wish they had gone the route of Project M in terms of stage variants. Maybe in an update one day? Probably not, though.
  • Nintygameplayerperson - October 9, 2014 12:15 a.m.

    The only exploits your average Joe uses in Melee are wavedashing and maybe wobbling. Meanwhile, Brawl has crap like easy-as-shit chaingrabs and grab-releases, locking, momentum-cancelling, RCO lag, Snake's hitboxes, and Meta Knight. Brawl isn't clean at all.
  • cptnoremac - October 8, 2014 7:46 a.m.

    I'm disappointed that they basically didn't give this game its own title (adding the system it's for at the end doesn't count). I'm just gonna keep calling it Super Smash Bros Ungodly Beatdown.
  • avedon-arcade - October 7, 2014 5:16 p.m.

    Greninja is great to use, he's a solid overall fighter, I'm just not fond of him in general to want to keep using him. Also I'd be more or really impressed at competition players on typical stages, rather than the flat ones. Maneuvering around the stage and your enemy would take a lot of skill.
  • Ken Serra - October 7, 2014 5:24 p.m.

    Oh yea, I've always wanted to watch that style of play lol. Well, I figure it might be more feasible in the newer games. In Melee, trying to keep up with wave-dashing and move cancels is already crazy as-is. XD
  • wyatt-boyer - October 7, 2014 2:19 p.m.

    This guy honestly has no clue what he's talking about...don't talk about the competitive scene unless you actually follow it.
  • Ken Serra - October 7, 2014 5:11 p.m.

    Hiya Wyatt, I'm a big follower of eSports actually and I follow the Smash community quite intimately. I watch every tournament--the ones streamed at least-- from the Big House all the way up to Evo. This article was written with our audience in mind, who may not follow the hardcore competitive scene as much as you or I so I strayed away from using all the complicated terms. Besides, this article is less my opinion and more me reporting on what the pros say--the ones I could get a hold of at least-- as well as their opinions that are openly public. If you have an issue with the content, you can let me know what areas I need to address but other than that, you'll have to reach out to the pros mentioned in the article. Thanks for the concerns! -Ken
  • Kyubeytor - October 10, 2014 9:37 p.m.

    Could you provide a source for who you contacted? Was it just M2K and Chillin, and could you provide their exact words? There are a couple issues with the article that I would like to address/reword. "In fact, Melee only holds competitive merit because it’s riddled with glitches and exploitable mechanics--mechanics Sakurai never intended to exist." Melee's metagame is not associated with glitches at all, other than a few, highly situational and character specific examples. The only two glitches I could find that have any use in competitive play are Samus's super wavedash (not really useful or used often) and Young Link's super jump/boomerang recovery (only works in version 1.0 of the game, also situational). I would ask you to use a word other than exploitable, but that word is very fitting. The only true exploit we use that was 100% not intended was wavedashing though. The aura surrounding the use of the word exploitable is often less than admirable though (often accusing pro players of "cheating"). The reason I'm asking for a source is because you claim that we think that Smash 4 is a combination of Melee and Brawl-it cannot really be described as 50% Brawl 50% Melee. It is more 85% Brawl 15% Melee. The general game flow is certainly sped up, which is very nice. You can fastfall like in Melee, which is also nice. Hitstun is increased, but knockback is generally higher (preventing follow ups. When it comes down to it though, the game has WAY more similarities to Brawl than Melee, such as... -Little to no shield stun -only 7 frames of shield drop time -Generally low combo potential -Multiple air dodges -No crouch cancelling -Dash start-up is not cancel-able or is too small of a window to be practical -High air speed -Buffed escape options -Long survival time, with edge play typically being in favor of the recovering The game, to me at least, generally feels like a refined, better flowing Brawl at the moment, with many of the nuisances and frustrations removed. While the game is still a considerably too one sided with defensive play being the strongest option by a considerable margin, camping is generally discouraged with the new ledge mechanics and nerfed projectiles. I am enjoying the game very much for all this, as it feels like a unique Smash game form Melee rather than just a frustrating one. However, the game did not make any effort to provide gameplay mechanics that allow for the depth, options, and technical skill of Melee, and you do not need to "recreate glitches" to accomplish this. The game is looking quite bare boned at the moment (but I feel like customization moves could be a pretty big deal).
  • _--_ - October 7, 2014 11:55 a.m.

    --i predict --SSBwiiU reviews will drop a week early --and all be above 8(meta score of 8.8) --and i assume --thats because nintendo will 'pay off' review companies --you see --most gamers think 'reviewers' get 'paid off' --but --thats not how it works --the CEOs of the companies reviewers work for get paid off --and then --the reviewers get 'letters' from their bosses
  • Omniscientspork - October 8, 2014 2:13 p.m.

    Glad to see you put on your tinfoil hat today.
  • _--_ - October 8, 2014 3:19 p.m.

    --its a prediction --cant call a 'dated' prediction ludicrous --until the date of the prediction comes
  • TanookiMan - October 7, 2014 11:51 a.m.

    One thing I'm enjoying about the 3DS version: you can play the music while your handheld is in sleep mode. It's like walking around with an IPod full of sweet video game music arrangements! I've been having a lot of early fun/ success with Pac-Man...I never thought I'd see the day.
  • Unoriginal - October 7, 2014 1:22 p.m.

    Thank you so much for bringing this to my attention! This is such a crazy awesome feature!
  • J-Fid - October 7, 2014 11:26 a.m.

    This is some good insight on Smash 4. I know everyone says Greninja is good, but I have such a hard time using him. I don't know, I just can't figure him out. Though I do see flashes of brilliance. BTW, Smash 4 Wii U comes out 11/21, the SAME day as Pokemon ORAS. My wallet might be in trouble.

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