Are old-school Sonic and Mario really that good?

Maybe they could even (GASP) take one game at sale from Good Old Games every week and see if it still stands as one of the classics. As if. Gamesradar taking a bit of time to give some attention to PC gaming. HAH! That's even the whole deal of the site. I sure know lots of PC games have gameplay decisions that'd be unacceptable by today's standards. Most glaringly adventurers, sure. If anyone is interested, that precisely what the PCGamer magazine is doing at the moment. They've looked at some nice titles as well. X-Com (besides graphics, holds itself well), Giants: Citizen Kabuto (pretty much stays the same when comparing to PCGamer's original review) and Dark Forces II (that one aged horribly).

As a few people said before, a regular feature of this would be great. I have so much nostalgia looking back at a lot of SNES era games, but from time to time I realize my love for certain games was misguided and they haven't stood the test of time (TMNT: Turtles in Time, Final Fight, Mortal Kombat to name a few). On the other hand there are some gems that would be amazing games released even today (Yoshi's Island, Link to the Past, Contra III: The Aliens Wars, Earthworm Jim). And it's nice to see Genesis fanboys getting owned 15 years later!

oh em gee!!!! peeple reelize Sonicz nawt just abut speedz!? gazp1!!

Speaking of bosses... how about the ridiculously easy final battle with Bowser at the end of SMW? At least in Sonic 2, I felt some sense of tension due to the fact that I had zero rings; jump too short to hit Eggman and you have to play the entire level over -- starting with Metal Sonic! I think it's also worth mentioning the amazing music in Sonic 2 and how well it complements each level. I still remember sitting in elementary school humming every song to myself during math class. Good ol' 90s. Thank you for taking the time to write this article.

Yeah, it can't be argued that the critic was biased. First off, I never really liked Sonic. It was enjoyable, but never considered it that great. But I know I never enjoyed Mario, so maybe I'm biased as well. The problem is that most of the complaints he makes about Sonic 2 are equally valid for Super Mario World, sometimes even more so. Stupid, grating bosses? Mario had a total of 2 good bosses, every other one was extremely repetitive, extremely easy, and, worst of all, weren't anywhere near fast to deal with (save for the first one). Also, most of SMW bosses had a stage gimmick that could kill you for a simple slip, not necessarily related to the boss itself. And the grating, obnoxious placement of secrets in Sonic? Surely, this means you don't think it is obnoxious at all a secret exit at SMW where you had to MISS A JUMP with yoshi under the stage's finishing line, and then jump from yoshi PAST the finishing line to get to the secret. That's the worst example, sure, but nothing in Sonic compares. And while Sonic may have had cheesy enemy placement, Mario had cheesy hazard placement. The bottomless pits of death are existent, and sometimes constant. In Mario most maps are composed more of death-pits than safe ground, and many hazards are much worse than Sonic's Trial and Error technique. Also, it has a LOT of death-traps that you can dig yourself into and can't do nothing but wait for inevitable death. As I said, I'm probably biased as well, especially because I'd rate these games way below the pedestals people like to place them. But Sonic's ratings are fair here, I believe. Yet, Mario deserve a 6 at most, if compared by the same standards. The non linearity of the Overland map didn't in the least make up for the linearity of the stages themselves. Where Sonic had several possible layers to go through, Mario only had at most, in special spots.

Great article and as "unoriginal " said before, it would be great to see these retro review features on a regula basis. I'd like you re-review super metroid. My favotire snes game of all time.

well i am glad to see both got good scores

There is no point to this you cant judge these by todays standards it's completely diffrent nowadays but good article none the less.

Great article. 'Sonic Twosday' was pretty darn massive, though some complained when they clocked it in 2 hours flat. Absolutely cracking game though. I played quite a bit of Mario 3 on NES but I always found him such a fiddly, inertia-heavy little bugger to control and having to jump 300 times a minute breaking blocks was tiresome compared to Sonic steaming through stages whilst bouncing off powerups and hoovering up rings. I wouldn't consider Sonic's enemies cheap by any means, least not when against the likes of Megaman and countless other finger cripplingly hard platformers (ladders 5 screens high and 1 hit from projectile spamming enemies knocks you back down to the bottom anyone? Fun as a boot in the junk). In Sonic though, hitting a spring without being in a spin is, more often than not, not a good idea anyway when most things that jump out can just be run down. Although with the nanosecond of reaction time you have when traveling at full tilt, considering that having slow moving enemies placed and utilised to successfully stop a rocketing ball of spinning death could be argued as being quite well designed. Trial and error was the only way I recall any 16bit platformer working. There was no 'AI' then, enemies had a set pattern. Tails simply responded to the same controls for Sonic, when you jumped he jumped. Learning the enemy placement, the terrain, the timing, then blazing through the stage in literally seconds was immensely rewarding. The enemies are placed both to catch you out or to the experienced, handy bounce pads enabling Sonic to cruise through the air that little bit longer whilst maintaining speed to snag that hidden powerup. Gushing nostalgic fanboy love aside, it's always nice to look back with articles like this. Keep the retro guff coming, thanks.

Looking back, I agree that the enemy placement in Sonic 2 was a bit cheap, but I think there was way too much weight put on that. Yes, it was tricky, but the game was ridiculously addictive, I remember countless time doing marathon Sonic 2 runs to try to finish it back on the Genesis. There probably could have been a more intuitive way to challenge the player, but regardless, it was challenging, but it was still fun. As for Tails, he's sort of a neutral element to me. Sure the AI was weak, but he never got in the way so it did not detract from the experience, and if you grabbed someone else and played co-op it could be quite fun (assuming that your friend was any good, or that you could convince them to play as Tails at all). I'm obviously a Sonic fanboy, well, Genesis Sonic anyway. But being as unbiased as I possibly can I'd say the game deserves more than a 7. I'd personally give it a 9.

Ok, i am a sonic fan boy, but i dont agree that the enemies are poorly placed. Its my main issue with the Nintendo-2d Sonic games, and i genuinely dont believe its a problem in Sonic 2, i can complete most of the levels without being hit (if i dont do something stupid lol) And with regard to the bosses, yes, the Wing Fortress Zone is possibly the worst boss ever created. But most of the other bosses are quite good, especially for the time it was created. And if we compare it to Mario 2d bosses (Which, to be honest, this is what the article is about), those bosses are usually very very uninspired...

i agree with this article exactly. i was hoping you guys wouldnt bag on super mario world because its truly great. sonic on the other hand is a series i have always hated even when it was at the top of its game. sonic 2 is todays halo 3 for me, mediocre and extremely overrated

I grew up playing games, and SMW was one of the 1st games I got on my SNES. I loved the ability to unlock hidden levels and the awesome powerups (feather, yoshi, fire flower, etc.). It's truly a gem among the many Mario games and still manages to impress to this day

I liked yoshi's island but for some reason i've never playes SMW

I'm not saying these retro games were bad, they're classics but I never saw the charm in them.

I miss real toast.

I don't think that it is possible to get a totally unbiased view of these games, unless you get a new gamer who's never heard of anything before. SMW=pwnnage though. Never played Sonic 2

wing fortress is one of my favourite levels, yes its really tough but thats why its so good. also i thought the bosses were pretty good and the final bosses were ace, metal sonic kicked ass. and why no mention of super sonic who gave the enoyable of somewhat frustrating task of collecting all the crystals a brilliant reward. sonic 2 is one of the greatest games and the writer of this article is obiously a mario fanboy. (sorry for any spelling mistakes)

"I fail to see how the Bosses in Sonic are 'tacky', it's like you were just desperate for an excuse to prove your more of a Mario fan." Says the obvious Sonic fanboy. Nice hypocrisy! I agree with Unoriginal's point, this made for a fantastic read, and something i'd definitely love to see more of on GR.

Hmm, first time I ever see only two "You'll hate"... o.O