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  • shawksta - October 11, 2013 11:59 a.m.

    This was a fantastic editorial, and a great point, we can all learn something from this as a gaming community.. Based Zach telling it like it should be.
  • GOD - October 11, 2013 11:45 a.m.

    To be fair, my response to Call of Duty is the same as my response to Twilight. I really can't stand it, see it as more of a cash in than something new, but won't make a comment on either unless I'm prompted to do so. They're just not for me, so what's the point in me commenting if I clearly am not the audience that it's reaching? I think the bigger problem just goes with whole entitlement of internet anonymity thing. If someone sees a review of something in a magazine that doesn't interest them, they'll just ignore it. If they see a review of something online (where most gamers now read game reviews) whether it appeals to them or not they feel that because they can easily make a permanent comment, that they can just unabashedly let loose any and all thoughts that they may have about the game. The keyboard for some people seems to be this magic portal that lets them remove their normal common sense filter. Don't like something you see while walking down the street? Most people will just ignore it. On the internet, you get every range of response possible from jokes to vile threats that don't even relate to what's going on. This is almost similar to the concept of online hatemail. You play a match, everthing is legit, but then sure enough you get a message after from someone saying a whole bunch of nasty stuff because you beat them. In a real sport, these are the same things that someone might mutter to themselves and never tell anyone, or just think but never say. The zero consequences of the internet makes people get lazy with self control and become vile. I'd say it is related to the lack of consequences because I remember one funny time when I got hatemail I continued sending smiley faces back to the guy and after maybe his third hatemail told him I was reporting him and to enjoy his ban... and which point he started apologizing, acting like he was just kidding, saying he just got a little out of hand, asked to be added to my friends list, and then turned vile all over again when I told him I'd already sent the report for hatemail.
  • TheMcFinder - October 11, 2013 11:45 a.m.

  • BladedFalcon - October 11, 2013 11:43 a.m.

    Very well thought and written article, Mr. Betka. And I definitely hope people can actually take the time to read it, THINK about it, and try to change their attitude even if a little, for better. And I include myself in this statement. As someone who's been hanging around here for years, I've had a wide range of conversations and argument with other gamers, from positive, constructive chats, to also vitrolic insult swinging. So I fully admit I also tend to react in a confrontational, negative manner when something rubs me the wrong, way, and is something I have to endeavor to reign in. Because ultimately, it's the positive conversations that keep me coming back, if it really was nothing but insult swinging around here, I'd probably have elft a long time ago. Anyway, regarding the main topic of beyond. I also agree, I haven't played the game yet, so I reserve my opinion about it until I do, but I'm definitely interested in checking it out because if nothing else, it TRIES to do something new, and I always respect that. Lastly, I just want to echo the sentiment of this article, and encourage people to at least TRY or play something before bashing it? Just last night I got a comment here of someone attacking me on an unrelated thread because I DARED to suggest that maybe David Cage's games aren't as "pretentious" as people love saying that they are. And yes, I know David Cage IS very pretentious himself, but that doesn't automatically negate the merits of his work. I DID play Heavy Rain, and while it's definitely a flawed product, it also pulled off some very interesting things, yet many seem that none of that matters because they suddenly decided to hate David Cage, and anything he says or touches.
  • GR_ZachBetka - October 11, 2013 12:01 p.m.

    Fantastic reply, I really appreciate the points you've posted. You last paragraph was well phrased and something that I wanted to talk about in the piece (but it just didn't fit): liking someone and liking their work are two totally different things. It definitely takes effort, but it's important to see that Beyond isn't David Cage. "And I definitely hope people can actually take the time to read it, THINK about it, and try to change their attitude even if a little, for better." That's the most I can ask for :3 Thanks again!
  • BladedFalcon - October 11, 2013 12:36 p.m.

    Yeah... That's actually something I always try to do: Separate the creator form the creation, because, they ARE different things altogether, and it has always bothered me how people can be so hateful about something just based on who created it, even if there is nothing wrong with the product itself, I've always found that to be unfair. And well, thank you ^^ But i admit it's easier to say it than actually do it and change it. Still, definitely going to try and even when something rubs me the wrong way, I might still address it, but I'll try to be less high strung about it.
  • shawksta - October 11, 2013 12:04 p.m.

    The same thing can be said about Phil Fish, he's too sensitive and is a massive jerk sometimes, but his work on Fez is admirable.
  • BladedFalcon - October 11, 2013 12:38 p.m.

    Pretty much. I really dislike Phil Phish as a person, mainly because he loves to talk trash and the becomes passive aggressive to the extreme when he gets hit back... Yet I have absolutely nothing against FEZ. And i might even have a lot of good to say about it if I had played it, but i haven't yet. Still, whatever merits FEZ has, should be taken as such, regardless of what Phish is or says.
  • PatHan-bHai - October 11, 2013 11:25 a.m.

    Why most people hate gamers...we're not a happy lot. I only read reviews for the heck of it. I am the final decider of what I like and what I don't. I subsequently didn't like Battlefield but I enjoyed Project I.G.I when I played it 2 hours just after giving up BF. Same thing with Spartan: Total Warrior and God of War. I love new and fresh things and games that take risks. Look at God of War! It's the same thing all over but it's still kinda enjoyable to play. Spartan, NOW, really needed a sequel. It had such a great just wasn't executed properly.
  • Germaximus - October 11, 2013 11:14 a.m.

    Very nice article. Well done. =)
  • RayPaw - October 11, 2013 11:12 a.m.

    Tom Bissell's writing on games is always thought-provoking ... I think it really helps that, as a writer for a (somewhat highfalutin) general interest site like Grantland, he's a bit of an outsider to the gaming press. While it's true that stereotypical "core" gamers seem to get almost violently bent out of shape over games like Beyond which deviate too far from their platonic ideal of what games should be, it's also true that there are different types of gamers out there and they want different types of games. There's a group out there that truly wants nothing more than yearly updates to Madden and COD and there's a group that genuinely enjoys experimental games like Beyond, Journey, Gone Home, etc. Different strokes for different folks. It's great that developers & publishers are recognizing that modern gamers are not a single monolithic entity and are catering to these different needs. It's a sign that the industry is maturing ... but, yeah, sometimes it feels like we are still waiting for core player community to do the same. Hopefully articles like this one from core gaming publications like GR will help move that cause along.

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