"If we focus too much on casual players, that would take away the bite": Nioh 3 may be an easier Soulslike, but Team Ninja considers "really good" players when testing

It's easy to make a hard game, and hard to make one that's just challenging enough. For some players, Nioh 3 landed a little shy of the difficulty standard set by previous games in the series and other action titles from developer Team Ninja of Koei Tecmo. Producer Kohei Shibata and Team Ninja studio head Fumihiko Yasuda tells us why some players might feel that the game is easier – hint: Dark Souls faced a similar problem – but also stresses that a satisfying challenge is still a guiding star throughout development and testing.

"It is hard to make it challenging," Yasuda says via interpreter. "I mean, it would be easy to defeat the player many times, but I think we want to make sure that it is challenging and fun. There's a lot of trial and error with it. Even for the player themselves, they may find it difficult to defeat a boss, but as they play, battle the boss each time, they can understand patterns or see ways, entry points, to defeat the boss. Eventually they do find a way to defeat the boss, and players will have that sense of achievement and will want to take on the challenge of trying to defeat [another] boss. I think that's really important, that there is an equal aspect to the action that is available in the game. And we are conscious to not make it too skewed in one direction or the other."

In testing, Yasuda notes that the core action team, who'll know all the ins and outs of the game, might not be able to relate to the average player's experience. Other members of the team get involved, of course, including the producer and director, to help ensure "something that is challenging but also fun."

I mentioned an anecdote about Nintendo having the least-skilled people in the office playtest a game in front of the team, and how that experience would be accounted for in things like balancing and tutorializing. Yasuda says "we do a little bit of that," but with a game like Nioh 3, they also have to factor in who the game is for.

"We want to have someone who's really good at the game to see if they can clear the game without taking any damage," for example, he says. "How those really skilled players can get through. And also have players who may not be as great at action games see if they can find alternate ways of clearing a stage or getting through. We do look at both sides as well, those that are really good at the game and those that may not be so good at action games."

Shibata hones in on hardcore and casual audiences and how they intersect with this type of Soulslike action RPG. "Not just Nioh, but I think with Team Ninja titles in general, I think a lot of people are anticipating the action element of it," he says. "That there is going to be a certain level of difficulty as a Team Ninja title. So when we do look at the less experienced side, we don't look at casual players as being that bottom base, because if we focus too much on casual players, that would take away the bite that Team Ninja action is known for. But we kind of look at people who are not experts in action games and see how they play and how they can get through it as well."

It's an interesting and evergreen debate: is it worth making a game in an inherently difficult genre, like a Soulslike, a little easier, either through balancing or even difficulty settings, to make it more approachable? The topic has also been on my mind as I've played Marathon, a hilariously unwelcoming game even for an extraction shooter. Games like Elden Ring prove you can reach tens of millions of people without compromising, of course. I generally just side with developer intent; if devs want their game to kick my ass, bring it on. Clearly, Team Ninja is happy to cultivate its hardcore reputation while making basic, sensible allowances for folks who might be trying their games for the first time.

"We referenced Elden Ring" on Nioh 3 and "the Soulslike label is correct," says lead dev, but it's not a "response to or interpretation" of FromSoftware's work.